The Dilemma for Checkers

[Jay H]

Watch out for the flying pigs!

You two guys on the same page
It's about time !!!!


The future is now.......




Regards

Jay "Eyes straight forward" H

[Eric Strange]

I could setup something like this for the ACF. Something simple like this I wouldn't even need my coder to help much. Now would we require this sign up or still allow players to just show up and pay at the tournament?
Would be great to have something like this for nationals. I could even setup a sponsor page for people who would like to sign up to sponsor the tournament. Because we always get some kind of news coverage I would think it shouldn't be so hard to get a sponsor especially if we mention the sponsors to the camera.

[Irma Sierra]

It may seems that I shouldn't give my opinion in this thread but anyway I will do it...

Who think that we are going to get more players because the money prize is big, is in a big mistake...why? because the checkers players (heart checkers players) play for the fun of play checkers and yes, for winning, there is a secret pleasure inside all of us when we win, (for me when I draw), we go to tournaments to play, I have paid 550 dls just to get where the tournament is 4 times, plus hotel and meals, (some gentlemen have invited me for dinner and I save some money) the cost for me to go is big and still I go....
Now, the young ones that are very good on internet, but haven't ever gone to a tournament for lack of money I have proposed before that the prize for those young ones should be to pay for their expenses.

About what Eric says: Alan!! wake up!! I think what Alan is doing is great, what we need is a copresident, a young one, he can be in charge of all the internet stuff, prizes, sponsors etc, is time for youth to take the reins, but of course they have to prove first they are good on it, to show with actions what they can do and let me tell you, I trust in youth, and then, they can be the honorable president of the ACF

I have seen many times examples how when youth get involved things change for good, they take risks, they are brave, they have new ideas... let's accept it, they are the future.

Still Eric and friends, we want respect, a respect well deserved, I have seen that youth now doesn't know that value.

MOney??? when you get to be the challenger of Alex M, you can make money, not before, first, get in love with that beautifull game called CHECKERS and once in love, you will go to tournaments to loss or win!!

[Chexhero]

Very true. I did not care about the money whatsoever going to the PA state. It could have been 100 dollar entry fee and no prize money, and I still would have gone! The real prize was playing and meeting live checker players!
Ummm, lets not get any ideas now

[jpost]

I will say this: I don't think there should be a drastic increase in prize money (from outside donations, at least) without a coordinated attempt to promote youth playing checkers across the country. Without it, we are really just wasting money on people already committed to the game. (I'm talking about prize funds OUTSIDE of entry fees here, also.)

[Danny_Alvarez]

I have heard some very good ideas ....
correct me if i am wrong but this is what i have heard.... it doesn't mean it is what y'all have said....

1) we need a youth representative/internet checkers representative on board the ACF
2) we should increase the entry fees for nationals
3) with that increased fund maybe we should direct it towards youth checkers and people that are not involved in the game now
4) we should attempt to find a sponsor/s
5) consider saving money on printing of ACF bulletins and make them electronically

did i forget anything?

change scares people, but i agree with Eric that unless we gather up courage to change certain things (not necessarily everything) we will not leave the game in better shape than what we found it in.
cheers
Danny

[Eric Strange]

I think we are having a great conversation without much argument. So here is what I say to all of that.

Irma. What you said about raising the prize money for all these players that already play and love the game. Your right to an extent but open your mind and think from the other side. Your a confident and very competitive person. You played checkers as a kid and consider it an easy kids game. You see an advertisement for a checkers tournament that is offering high amount of money. Now your intrigued and want to give it a shot. You play a few games talk to some cool people and although you got completely whooped because you didn't realize that this game is very difficult when you get in depth with it. Your now hooked and plan to get better so you can win that money back next year.

There has been many players who play this game every single day online that wont go to a tournament because the money is not worth their time. I have said this before and I will say it once again.

WE NEED TO FIND A WAY TO GET PEOPLE TO TRY THIS GAME IN A COMPETITIVE WAY AND PEOPLE WILL GET HOOKED AND OUR GAME WILL SLOWLY GROW. THE FACT THAT PEOPLE SEE THIS GAME AS AN EASY KIDS GAME IS AN ADVANTAGE FOR PROMOTION AND WE NEED TO CHALLENGE THE WORLD!!!!

the fact is that with more players = more prize money

so what we need to do is raise the buy ins to increase the prize money at least long enough to gain more players. Some of you will say 5000 got donated to youth tournament in Vegas and nobody came. TRUE because nobody knew about it!!!!
we need to put some effort into advertising and getting the word out there. Instead of spending money on bulletins put it towards online advertising. American Checkers Federation advertisement banners on pogo, yahoo, come2play, etc.

There are thousands of players who play online every single day and 95% of them have no idea what the American Checkers Federation is. How about creating an ACF facebook, myspace, twitter accounts and getting people to spam it to their facebook friends. There is a lot of pro-active things we can do to grow this game even a little bit and nobody is doing anything except me and a very small handful of others like JR and a couple others!!!!!!!

I have been trying to make our game more organized first before I try to advertise it. I have a web page for people to learn this game. I am pro-actively getting ratings updated and will eventually mesh online checkers play into the ACF with some pretty advanced and intense online advertising strategies. I am even eventually going to have online tournaments and sponsor a winner to go to a tournament. But honestly I am starting to feel like I am all alone with my ideas and that nobody cares about our game enough to help me. I will keep moving along like the little engine that could but I can't help a group that does not want to be helped. We need to stop talking and start doing stuff. If anyone wants to help then please ask me what they can do to help or offer something forward even it is an idea on what you would like to see. Everyone that has helped with anything has been put on my checkers page as a contributor.... lets try and make that page HUGE and maybe we can save our game.... I mean cmon... SCRABBLE is more popular... give me a break. I do not want to hear how busy everyone is either... that is just a cop out... I work a full time job, manage my websites, take care of a family which includes a 3 year old daughter with type 1 diabetes and go to college full time... beat that.

Checker is my #1 hobby and the only people who support me is my friend VAD who codes for me when he has time for FREE and he doesn't even play checkers anymore.

I'll stop now... sorry for my rant ha ha

<3

[tommyc]

WOOOOOOW..........congratas Eric.........never knew yu had a "bairn" I hadnt noticed it on yur posts anyways.Keep up the good work,i had the same enthuseism but im, afraid it got battered to a pulp till it died of rejection so the status quo remains,still i wish yu all the best.Nothing beats the enthus of youth.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

To John Post.

John, your idea to raise entry fees is interesting though not a new. I am missing a point - what group of people today don't play in tournaments because of low competition, and they will get in and play if we raise entry fee ?

From my sceptical point of view, raising fees up to $100 in Master Division can dramatically reduce number of attendants, leaving probably me and Ron King + people who have extra money and are ready to spend them. For me and my family $100 is a quite good money which helps us to pay for food and gas for 2-3 days ... at least to say.

So ... again, I am afraid that results of increasing fees may have a negative affect and differs from what you expect. More intensive market study is needed.

In other hands, I am completely OK to raise ACF annual memership from $25 to $35-$40.



Regards,

Alex

[Bobby_Loewen]

I agree..i play checkers in the breakroom at work..and people just stare..and say to me wow ..bobbys playing a kids game..cause they just dont understand..this game could easily get popular if we promote it and make it more widespread like eric stated...its not a boring game..and scrabble is garbage..i hate it..and i know how to spell just fine..it just bores me..give me a damn break...myself and jonathan who has a new found respect for the game..after attending the PA tourney with me..are going to the library to get a checkers club started..i will teach people the game..and we can go from there...hopefully we get some people in town interested..but our town sucks and it consists of druggies and alcoholics pretty much..its a sad thing..but im definitely up for trying to promote the game..

im an internet player..but alan said himself..some players wont come cause theyre proggers..people just need to get over that..and come play the game..and have fun with it..i came in 5th in the PA tourney..i held my own against alot of very good players..after billy rungee told me not to pretty much bother..i used that as extra motivation haha..lets make checkers big..lets make it bigger than its EVER been..restore more credibility to this game!

[Bobby_Loewen]

yahoo would have been awesome to advertise at..but its been overrun with playbuddies and alot of competitive players..just stopped playing..i remember 10 yrs back..when the game was huge..and checker teams were the hip thing in town .. lol

[Eric Strange]

I have actually been playing scrabble since I was 7 years old with my grandpa who does crosswords for fun in his spare time and has a very large vocabulary. I enjoy scrabble a lot and play it very well. I am not dumping on it because I do think it is a very challenging and fun game.

My issue with it being a more popular is that EVERYONE has played checkers before. Many don't even know what scrabble is!!!

as far as a lot of people being programmers on sites. Kurnik has very very few of them and it is obvious who they are. Yahoo WAS overrun with playbuddies and the higher level players stopped competing. Once again people are too focused on the Better players and not focused on EVERYONE. I guarantee those 2000+ <1500 don't program at yahoo and play everyday would come to tournaments if they knew they existed. They have plenty of time to get good.

[Eric Strange]

I cannot connect to the server through the router firewall and I am at work so I do not have access to that router. If you play on any others sites let me know.

[ae_ted]

Eric, put me down for support to your efforts. If that means money, let me know and I will put what I would have paid in ACF dues toward your effort. The only way checkers is going to grow is to embrace the online part. The good ol boys club turns me off anymore. I always have been and always will be a supporter of young players (also women), and hope a new era in checkers will emerge. There are many people who promote and encourage checkers and my hope is that we can draw from those and and build a new organization.

[Eric Strange]

I cannot connect to the server through the router firewall and I am at work so I do not have access to that router. If you play on any others sites let me know.

Not really, no-- ISC is the only one which uses both the tournament rules and the official word list. Facebook comes close, but it doesn't allow for challenges, so word knowledge is moot.

well lets go play at facebook anyways