WHAT DO ACF MEMBERS THINK

[Colin Webster]

As most of you are already aware, Mind Sports South Africa is recognised through South African law as the controlling body for draughts and checkers (as well as other games) in South Africa.

What we have seen recently is a fair amount of meddling in our affairs by the ACF, who have taken it upon itself to invite Lubabalo Kondlo as a 'wild card' to the WCDF Qualification Tournament last year (2007).

Granted that Lubabalo is an exceptional player, but it must be noted that Lubabalo has not been a registered player since 2001.

Such action was of his own volition.

As of today I have received another missive from the ACF's Mr. Alan Milhone that Lubabalo will be coming back to the USA for the ACF's 2009 GAYP Nationals as well as one other person from his area.

While the MSSA welcomes all such charity, don't you think that it would be better if a more sustainable development project can be determined which has the buy-in of both the MSSA and the UCF?

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Hello, Mr. Webster !

I am glad to see you on this forum. In response on your question I can say - ACF doesn't have much support for Lubabalo, it was a personal Alan Millhone initiative and he spent his own money to pay Lubabalo expanses. ACF as an organisation only helped Lubabalo to recieve passposrt and obtain Ameican visa. In the last match with Ron King Lubabalo didn't represent South Africa, he was endorsed by WCDF. I didn't know that Lubabalo is coming to USA GAYP National 2009 but I am glad tohear this - any new strong player is always welcome to play in ACF events ! I know - many talented players from oversea (including Europeans) would like to come, but this is a bit expansive.

As ACF member in good standing, I don't have much concern about Lubabalo support, because ACF did't take any penny from it's budget. And I don't have any moral rights to tell Alan Millhone (or anyone else) - how he should spend his money. Although, as ACF member, I would vote against idea to spend any kind money from ACF budget for such purposes. If we have extra money which we can spend - there are many talented but poor American young players where we (ACF) can pay their expanses.

Colin. at the end of my post I would like to say something positive ... I heard recently rumors that ACF plans to send a group of several top players to South Africa, (probably even next year) to play a social match and for exhibition purposes. In particular - Alan Millhone and Lubabalo told me this, and I was glad to hear such interesting nerws. Do you know anything about this ?

Respectfully,

Alex Moiseyev

[Colin Webster]

Dear Alex

Thanks for your views - they arealways welcome.

Wow, that is great to read that the ACF is willing to send players to South Africa for to play social matches and exhibition games.

However, may I suggest that the trip should be expanded in scope to include official test matches? If official test matches are held, such matches will undoubtably be opened by the Minister of Sport and Recreation.

Should the Minister be in attendance, the entire roadshow would receive national television and newspaper coverage.

The MSSA has access to superb venues in all South African cities. The MSSA even has access to Olympic House as a venue (the home of the South African Olympic Committee - http://www.sascoc.co.za).

Also the MSSA would treat all the visiting Americans well - just ask Hugh Devlin!

If you are interested to see how we would treat you, just go to: http://www.bhgs.co.uk/gallery/IWF2002/IWFmemories.htm

So far Alan has not contacted me, and I am anxiously waiting for his call.....

Together, I am sure that the ACF and the MSSA could deliver an event that would be long remembered by those that participate in it, and envied by those that didn't.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Colin, I am glad to see that my (actually yours) post generated a positive constructive dialogue which hopefully shold be ended with some real deals !

Ball now is in Alan Millhone hands and I hope he will update us here with more details.

Me and the whole American team will be glad to play more offical test matches by GAYP or mix style (both, 3-moves and GAYP). We already did this once in 2004 on Barbados and will be glad to repeat in SA in 2009.

I understand the main problem will be financial - ACF should find the way (sponsors ?) to cover fully or partially American players travel expanses. Thats not an easy deal, but nothing impossible for Alan Millhone

I like your pictures very much and enjoy them. Hey, I wonna be there !!!

And indeed, all these exciting events may help to restore Lubabalo and SA draughts Federation relations which will be another good outcome.

One or another way he is an ambassador outside of SA and even if he wasn't endorsed by his own Federation, but now we can't ignore the fact of his existance and influence!

In addition, I also hope that working close and together with Alan Millhone on the upcoming tour may help both of you to improve your relations!!! ==> which is always better for business

Respectfully,

Alex Moiseyev

[tommyc]

And indeed, all these exciting events may help to restore Lubabalo and SA draughts Federation relations which will be another good outcome. ..........says Alex.

I agree with Alex and hope for the same return, whether MSSA agree Lubablo is the face of S.A checkers as we see it thanks to Alan MIllhones intervention and can only be for the Global good of the game whatever personal or political differences there may be.I had conversations in Las Vegas in 2007 with Lubablo and i know he has issues but nothing that cant be overcome.When Hugh Devlin went to S.A. a few years ago i know he was treated to the best that is not an issue.

I am not going to condemn the MSSA in any way, i might think this could have been sorted out before now and as Alex says perhaps these conversations will be conductor in that direction.

Well, well, well, in all my time knowing you Alex i nvr took you as a peace broker, but you seem to have that facility and well done to you. In you position as World Champ im glad to say you opinion carries alotta weight and i hope your message is heard loud and clear.

On the down-side (Ingos naivity abt committies just jumped out at me) but im hoping Mr Webster will be an exception to that rule and by his "tone" up till now i await with bated breath!!

Sometimes it takes a big man to make big decisions but Mr Websters non reply to Alexs last post is a sign of things to come............but he must have the "benefit of the doubt" until he does so.!! .!!!

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Tommy, this is always way in doth directions Mr. Colin Webster said that he haven't heard anything from Alan Millhone regards upcoming tour, and I think the next step of restoration should not be just post in forum, but Alan and Colin should start working together on details and issues.

My main title is not "World Champion", but "Checkers Player" and whatever is good for checkers works for me

Regards,

Alex

[tommyc]

1]I concur with your humility Alex as "no1 checker player" ..........CHAMP.

2]You know Alan as well as i do and we both know he can speak for himself.

3]The two main components namely Mr Webster and Lubablo Kondlo are in S.A. and to me thats the starting point as i see it, if both men are big enough for the task..............thats whats broken and thats what needs fixing im sure they wouldnt appreciate any "outside" interference!!

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Tommy, don't jump on solutions It is only easy to destroy relations, which can be done in 5 seconds, but it is never easy to restore things back to acceptable level, and sometimes it takes months or years. What is most important now - Alan and Colin should start working together on exhibition tour issues and details unconditionally and unemotionally and this eventually could (should!) imrpove everything.

So, I propose just talk about exhibiion tour of American Checkers players to South Africa.

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In 2004 we played against Barbados team in format close to our traditional matches USA vs GB & I: 10 players from each team + 2 alternative players. Everyone from one team played against everyone from another team - 10 rounds, 5 days (Monday-Friday), 2 rounds a day, 4 games.

This is very serious and solid professional format which doesn't leave us much time for any other activities. Maybe we can find something more softer but having more time and flaxibility for other activities. For instance, I can play simultenious games or blindfold games etc We also can play blitz games

There is a plenty choice of oprtions - everything is in ouir hands !

What do you think, Colin / Alan ?

Regartds,

Alex

[Colin Webster]

First let me say the MSSA has no issues whatsoever with Lubabalo affiliating, and the MSSA has since August 2007 tried to get him to rejoin.

Now that Alan has taken an active interest in encouraging him to affiliate, I am sure that it won't take long.

Having seen the ACF team in action in Morecombe in 2001 (awesome) and the way you play test matches, I would agree with Alex's slightly softer approach that would enable the team to see some big game (perhaps rub a lion, or ride an elephant) while promoting the game.

It would be nice if perhaps we could do a 'condensed' test match, but a test match nevertheless.

Such a test match would attract a great deal of media coverage.

To give you an idea, when Hugh came out, he was interviewed twice on national television and the one match was filmed and broadcast on national television as well. Not only that but there were 6 newspaper articles -one of which was front page!

As a recognised federation we are obliged to inform the Minister of Sport, and since 2009 is an election year, he is bound to be there...

Currently, we have 12 school clubs (clubs based at schools) and it would be great if we could take you round to do a demo at some of those schools.

When Hugh came out here, he visited three schools and was mobbed by the kids wanting his autograph.

But, it all depends on time, and finances!

The sooner we can sort out a plan the sooner I can start looking for sponsorships.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

I agree that soft format would work better and more efficient allowing players and organsers more flexability. Combination of short various events, each about 1-2 days, perhaps in different locations (schools, clubs etc) will attract more SA players & kibitzors and should get more media coverage.

Regards,

Alex

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John, Barbados checkers fraternity has two Federations today - due to serious controversy and conflict which Ron King had with old Federation, BDA ... and he created his own Federation, BCDF, which was registered in WCDF. However, FMJD doesn't allow more than one Fedeartion from one country. South Africa sends two players to Beijing this year as it is required by rules. In addition, as far as I know, South Africa has a good number of strong 10x10 International Draughts players. South Africa is a member of FMJD in good standing for quite long time.

SA Draughts Federation didn't endorse Lubabalo in 2007, because he didn't play in the recent National tournaments for long time. There are other champions here who will play in Beijing. In China we have Olympic Games where players represent the country. As soon as Lubabalo rejoin with Federation, he will have a chance to go through normal course of qualification and recognition: National Championship ==> Qualify Tournament ==> World Title Match.

Whatever we had in the last GAYP cycle was just an exception which maynot happened again, because WCDF eliminated "Wild Card" option.

Anyway ... I think there are more important things which we can talk and which help us to improve everything.

[Colin Webster]

Question: since the MSSA objects to sending Lubabalo to the 2007 QT and to the recently completed WCM, are they sending any players of their own choosing to Beijing? Also, if Lubabalo is "unaffiliated" with your group, are there other competing checkers/draughts federations in SA, as there are in Barbados?

Please note that there is only one governing structure in South Africa for draughts and checkers, and that is Mind Sports South Africa.

In terms of our Constitution, and the rules of our governing structures, the MSSA is only able to send registered players to officially represent South Africa.

The MSSA was hoping to send Lubabalo to Beijing, and that is why the MSSA asked him in August 2007 to register and to compete in our events that would enable him to be selected.

The MSSA's AGM shall be held on 7 December 2008. My hope is that Lubabalo will be registered by then, so, not only can he have his say, but he can stand for a position on the committee and lead checkers in the direction that he wants it to go.

And yes, we are sending two other players, namely, Lebogang Shibambu (2008 North West Provincial Champion) and Thabo Mokoena (2007 S A National Champion).

[Colin Webster]

Josh, you are right it is as easy as filling in a form.

Lubabalo has two choices. The first to register through an existing club, or secondly to start his own club.

I believe that Lubabalo wishes to start his own club, which does require a little more than just one form, but whichever he chooses we welcome him to join.

[Ingo_Zachos]

...
While the MSSA welcomes all such charity, don't you think that it would be better if a more sustainable development project can be determined which has the buy-in of both the MSSA and the UCF?

I beg your pardon, but it was no "charity "to allow a player to play in an ACF event.

The ACF has its own rules and Mr.Kondlo finally found a sponsor.
And, I have to say he did very well for South Africa, and we all hope to see more from him and the best players from South Africa.
It is a pity that the player who has the best chances for gaining a medal in Beijing was not nominated by South Africa.
It is easy for him to blame the MSSA, and easy for you to blame Mr.Kondlo.

As Alex Moiseyev said:

...

And indeed, all these exciting events may help to restore Lubabalo and SA draughts Federation relations which will be another good outcome.

One or another way he is an ambassador outside of SA and even if he wasn't endorsed by his own Federation, but now we can't ignore the fact of his existance and influence!

...

So I hope that the MSSA finds a way to organize events like team competiitons aginst other countries, and that you also find a way to sent the best South African players to international events.

It would pay off for you and your federation.

I know that there are constitutions, and rules of our governing structures.
But these rules and structures can be adjusted if necessary if the federation is willing to do so.

Greetinx from sunny Dortmund, Germany

Ingo Zachos

[Colin Webster]

You may all be interested to note that today Alan Milhone and I had a long (about an hour) telephonic conversation.

In such conversation, we thrashed out all our differences and we both listened to each other in order to fully understand each others points of view.

I wish that I had spoken to Alan sooner!

As it so happens, we both seem to be on the same page as both the ACF and MSSA are absolutely committed to growing the game. All that is different is our methodology and our immediate priorities.

The good thing is that both Alan and I are committed to working together in order to achieve the best possible result for all checkers players.

I would really like to thank Alex, whose positive influence, proved to be a catalyst in this regard.

[tommyc]

Any right thinking person would have to say Mr Webster "is big enough"and has in his own words tried to set things right in regard to this disagreement between the parties ................but we all know theres two sides to every story,so lets hear Lubablos interpetation then the picture will be much clearer..............and with a little bit of "give and take" the problem between them can be peacefully resolved,isnt that what every one would want.??!!