The Journey Continues (read more)

[Eric Strange]

So now that we have completed the Checkers portion of the website http://cross-board.com/checkers we are moving on!!!! we have already started creating a web based calculator for Elo rating system to help out the ACF. me and my coder spent about 2 hours today discussing game plan and what we think would work best. We have decided on:

1. you input how many player and how many rounds in the tournament
2. a form opens that looks just like a standard cross table format we use in tournaments
3. someone inputs the data from their tournament cross table into the online cross table
4. person from step 3 clicks submit
5. every players ratings are now updated from that tournament

Easy enough?

I wont bore you with the technical details but it will basically calculate round by round so that ratings are as accurate as possible. once this system is in place it should not be hard to do the same thing for the WCDF if they would like this. Other details that will be nice is that players inactive for over 5 years will be moved into a section called the "B" list and basically dropped off of the active rating section. My website coder Vadim told me that compared to the checkers site he just finished this project will be a piece of cake and said that it should be finished by the end of the year. We can start 2011 with some brand new study material and ratings!!!!

Thank you,

Eric Strange

[Jason Solan]

Easy enough?

Almost, but not quite. Just some suggestions.

As I mentioned before, the calculation is the easy part, getting the correct players is the difficult part. Many crosstables contain partial names or nicknames. Many times names are misspelled.
Eric Strange may or may not be the same person as Erick Strange. It could be a different person or the name could just be misspelled. I would suggest a list of values type of choice for trying to find a player's name.
But what you're asking is also double work for the tournament reporter. They already have a crosstable, either on paper or in a spreadsheet. Now you're asking them to type it all out again. I would suggest a place to upload their crosstable and try to programatically figure it out to seed in the data for them. This may not be feasible with handwritten crosstables.
Also, based on your method you're going to need a place to store ratings at the end of every tournament(at least). Otherwise if the reports come in out of order, then the ratings are not accurate. I like the fact that we'd have a history of ratings and it makes sense, just making sure you're aware of it.

Thanks for your efforts and if you would like some help on the project let me know.

[Eric Strange]

Easy enough?

Almost, but not quite. Just some suggestions.

As I mentioned before, the calculation is the easy part, getting the correct players is the difficult part. Many crosstables contain partial names or nicknames. Many times names are misspelled.
Eric Strange may or may not be the same person as Erick Strange. It could be a different person or the name could just be misspelled. I would suggest a list of values type of choice for trying to find a player's name.
But what you're asking is also double work for the tournament reporter. They already have a crosstable, either on paper or in a spreadsheet. Now you're asking them to type it all out again. I would suggest a place to upload their crosstable and try to programatically figure it out to seed in the data for them. This may not be feasible with handwritten crosstables.
Also, based on your method you're going to need a place to store ratings at the end of every tournament(at least). Otherwise if the reports come in out of order, then the ratings are not accurate. I like the fact that we'd have a history of ratings and it makes sense, just making sure you're aware of it.

Thanks for your efforts and if you would like some help on the project let me know.

I do see your concerns. The name field in the form is going to be linked to the SQL database. So you will either have an alphabetical order drop down list, or something to make it easier to identify the proper person. It will also be easy to add someone if they are new and the rating system will automatically treat them as provisional for 30 games. As far as their names being so close that they get mixed up. I think this will occur far and few between and can be adjusted if it happens. The Tournament reporter will not have to do this. Very few people will have the ability to officially edit ratings. The same channels will be in place. It seems most tournaments give their cross tables to JR and to Beckwith. Honestly I would not mind putting in a few names and typing in a bunch of numbers to rate a tournament. So there will still be a job for whoever does ratings but it will be simplified. I looked at a few different cross tables and the format of each one just is not consistent enough. Some have other fields that others don't and like u said typo's. So making it parse a cross table would be difficult. With what I have imagined I could type of a 50 player tournament in 10 minutes and have it calculated. What I have found out about ratings have scared me very much Jason as far as the way they were calculated in terms of accuracy. I do believe we are getting a good system with cross tables being submitted with JR and nccheckers.org. JR seems very willing to help me so I think we can calculate tournament by tournament without a problem. I will also include an area where they can upload a cross table. Once it is uploaded someone with the username and login can officially calculate the ratings. Being a coder you understand how it starts with an idea and as the project progresses more and more ideas and things get added. I enjoy what Jason did here with by showing me possible obstacles before I got to them. I wish everyone would do that.

Jason I am not sure how much time you have on your hands but I could always use an extra set of coding hands. Let me know if you use any instant messengers and I'll add you

[Jason Solan]

Ok, I was under the impression you were going to have the tournament director input the crosstables themselves. If there's still going to be a group of "ratings processors", for lack of a better term, then it sounds like a good plan.

I've seen a lot of projects fail or at least not be as good as they could have been because of shortsightedness, many of them my own. I don't want to criticize, I just want to try and help point out things that may not have been thought of before the project gets too far.

I sent you a PM with some other stuff.

[Jolt]

Eric has just told me that his wife will take care of many of the clerical duties involved with keeping up to date ratings. He said she will spearhead the project by standardizing everyone's names, even if it means calling 100s of people. She'll help ensure data integrity; thus, I have no doubt that Eric will be able to successfully complete this project.

She will:

1.) Update the ratings within half a day of a tournament ending.
2.) Ensure data integrity
3.) Highly prioritize this task in her life.

I think she should be commended for her proactivity.

[Eric Strange]

Eric has just told me that his wife will take care of many of the clerical duties involved with keeping up to date ratings. He said she will spearhead the project by standardizing everyone's names, even if it means calling 100s of people. She'll help ensure data integrity; thus, I have no doubt that Eric will be able to successfully complete this project.

She will:

1.) Update the ratings within half a day of a tournament ending.
2.) Ensure data integrity
3.) Highly prioritize this task in her life.

I think she should be commended for her proactivity.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Yeah right Jolt

Since all the tournaments have been done using WCDF ID I had to take the acf ratings list and and match each user with his WCDF ID... took me about 2 hours..... Next I will seperate into B-List and A-List and get rid of any checkers players I know to have passed away. I spoke with my coder for about 3 hrs last night and he and I came into the decision that crosstables need to be written out using each players ID and not just their name. Secondly I will have a cross table form on my website that tournament organizers can use instead of excel or piece of paper. That way they only have to fill out the cross table once and everything is dress right dress.... basically when we are done with this section of the website it will be every single tool you can possibly need for a tournament. I will keep all of you updated.

[Eric Strange]

We will actually be adding our own own web based pairings programs as well. So if they use the web based pairings program from my site it can also fill out a cross table at the same time and sorta work together. The world is basically our oyster but it will be mandatory to use proper ID for each player in order for anything to function properly!!!!

[Eric Strange]

So.... this is what I'm thinking.... I REALLY WANT HONEST OPINIONS!!!!

My site will have a pairings systems, SWISS, ROUND ROBIN, ETC.

Tournament directors can use the pairings system throughout the tournament and it will automatically fill out a cross table in conjunction with the pairings system. Cross table and pairings system will be able to support players who abandon game trny, bye's, new players and anything else u could want including honor point calculations for those close decisions.

These cross tables will be submitted to my website for rating processing as well as emails to checkers officials who need them.

The cross table will be looked over to confirm no errors and that it is a valid tournament.

Because cross table and everything is created in an all-in-one system the cross table output will be able to be processed into valid and updated ratings just by clicking a button. The processing for ratings will be able to add new players to active player list, generate a valid ID for this player, drop inactive players to a B list, and bring inactive players back into active list when they play again.

This will be the full package!!! Everything required for proper tournament processing will be included in this and should fix all problems EVERYONE IS HAVING

any questions?