The Golden Age of Checkers

[Ingo_Zachos]

It was the best of times, it was the worst of times.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Alex, I'm curious: does your definition of a "golden age" include champions being able to make a living exclusively by playing checkers?

John, my definition includes this and more, more, more ... if we want to name some specific period of time as "Golden Age". It includes base of pyramid - massive number of players and popularity, it includes media publicity and respect, and it includes also pick of pyramid - 20-50 best players should be able to play checkers for living and few top of them should be rich.

Saying "massive" I have in mind at least 10,000 (ten thousand) players. ACF during it's prime time had 1,500-2,500 members (today 350). We never being even close to this level.

Thats why any conversations and disputes here about "Golden Age in Checkers" sound very disturbing and painful for me and I want to cry and looking for my gun

I am treating and considering checkers very high thats why what we have now and had in the past looks very low for me.

Alex

[Danny_Alvarez]

maybe you should provide proof Alex.

OK. Give me your definition of "Golden Age in Checkers" and we'll go from there ... if I agree with them.

Also we have to decide - are we talking about Worldwide Checkers or American Checkers or any other geographical regio. Maybe we can find "Golden Age in Checkers" in Europe (end of 1800's ?) or in USA (1930's-1950's ?) or in Barbados (1980's-2000's). Thats possible.

My personal definition of Golden Age always includes Financial Success as one of requirement
and we never accomplish this in any given period of time.

Sometimes we had Publicity, Populaity, Respect - another MUST criterias, but never Financial Success.

Golden Age of Checkers is still ahead.

For me personally all these discussions are very painful and disturbing because remind me all our failures.

Alex I don't mean this as disrespect but i will use a quote that a very wise man once made (ironically enough, to describe your country).
Alex you are "a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma" .... (I am quoting the great Winston Churchill)

On the one hand you want the game to grow and have lots of numbers and to financially reward its top players, and you do understand that to achieve this we need a pyramid with lots of players on the bottom to support this structure. (so far so good)

On the other hand you scold, belittle and silence anyone who dares talk about promotion (which to you it seems, is the worst word in the english language) or who dares spout a different opinion than yours. in order for your dream to occur we need more younger players, more women and more average players and promoters. You have not only not supported all aspects of the game you have openly and publicly declared that you "hate" GAYP .... if that is the world champion's view what hope is there to attract more to our fellowship of players????

I know that you will misinterpret this as me having another go at you.... Honestly i am not.... if i didn't care i would say nothing and i would be silent and i'd let you hang yourself with your own words.

i do care...

If your dream is to become a reality.... if we are to ever have YOUR definition of a golden age.... you must start appreciating that we are all different and we want the same. and that every time we shoo away somebody interested in checkers it takes millions of people and a couple of years to find another one. I for one would like to help bring about a golden age in checkers..... and i'll try. but you have far more influence and you aren't using it. You are letting your intransigency against different opinions cloud your judgement. Don't you see that we yearn to have a champ we can rally behind???

This is my recipe to achieve your dream:
1) if you find or hear anyone trying to improve the game or just talking about it.... either support them or remain silent.
2)do whatever you can to be super positive about the game (not just in america, about the game everywhere)
3) tolerate stuff that annoys you , think of the big picture
4) dont belittle others

I am not saying the fate of the game rests with you, what im saying is you as the world champ through your actions can make this a lot easier to occur. and in my humble opinion at the moment you are saying one thing and doing another.
i have gone on for far too long.... i hope this makes you think, that is all i want.
Regards
Danny Alvarez

[Palomino]

Danny wrote:

In my opinion at the end of the ninteenth century and beginning of the 20th checkers was at its golden age.

Danny, I think you're right about that.

Danny also wrote:

At the end of the day this is very very subjective, so there isn't a right or wrong answer.

Danny, I know you're right about that!


This subject has fascinated me and brought to mind one of my favorite cowboy poems.
For a bit of fun I've reworked and retitled it here. (Forgive me Mr. Black)


"The Golden Age of Checkers"

We psychoanalyze ourselves
And pondered at our fate.
Then realized that we were born
A hundred years too late.

Back then every school age boy could
Read and write (11-15, 23-18) in code,
And all the papers had checker columns
I'm a speakin' about a hundred years ago.

Once, every checkerist worth his salt
Was well known by his last name.
Mention the name of Wylie now
And the looks you get are absolute insane!

A checker player in this day and age
Gets no respect and when this you realize.
The fact that we are barley gettin' by
Really comes as no surprise.

There was a time when the average Joe
Needed to see 20 or 30 checker moves ahead.
But that's all in the past because
We have progs to do that for us now instead!

We might 've made a livin' at our game
If we'd lived a hundred years ago,
But now our champion Moiseyev
Hardly makes a dime you know.

Somehow I think if we had lived
When checkers reigned supreme
We'd all of carved our niche in history,
At least that is what I've dreamed.

We'd of built our reputations with
Each each and every splendid move.
Our daring exploits would have made
Our names everyday household words.

Amongst the checker players of today
I'm really just an average Joe.
But like to think I'd of been a better me,
If I'd lived a hundred years ago.

If only fortune would have smiled
On me and laid my egg back then.
I'd of been a happy man for sure,
Instead of who I am.

But I guess we should be thankful
In spite of what I've said.
If we'd been born in that "Golden Age"
We'd all surely now be dead!


Alex wrote:

Golden Age of Checkers is still ahead.

I hope you're right Alex! I believe it's much easier to face the future with optimism.

Regards..."Pal"

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Danny, lets focus on subject, don't leak water on forum bla-bla-bla. I still didn't hear from you YOUR definition of "Golden Age in Checkers". My definition is simple: success in each field and aspect of business: massive number of players and events at all levels, publicity, respect, recognition, financial stability.

You said alot about me but not much about subject. In dispute you like to bring other people down in every possible way and make them miserable. But with all your power on this forum remember - there are other ordinary people who may disagree with you - thats what democracy is about.

You can find more about democracy here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy

If you want other people respect you - you have to respect them and their opinion which may differ with your opinion and view. You treat checkers at miserable level as Tic-Tac-Toc and I can't accept this.

[Danny_Alvarez]

Danny, lets focus on subject, don't leak water on forum bla-bla-bla. I still didn't hear from you YOUR definition of "Golden Age in Checkers". My definition is simple: success in each field and aspect of business: massive number of players and events at all levels, publicity, respect, recognition, financial stability.

Alex my definition is the same as yours... my opinion is not.

You said alot about me but not much about subject. In dispute you like to bring other people down in every possible way and make them miserable. But with all your power on this forum remember - there are other ordinary people who may disagree with you - thats what democracy is about.

Dear Alex: the only one here acting in an authoritarian way is you. You called for this thread to be closed because in your opinion there is nothing more to be said. I quote from yesterday both you and me... which one sounds more ‘democratic’ to you???? The one saying close the topic or the one saying there isn’t a right or wrong answer???

I still haven't heard any prove regarding so-called Golden Age in Checkers. My statement is simple - Checkers never had a Golden Age now and in the past. If you disagree - then provide your arguments, if agree - nothing to discuss and we can close and discontinue topic.

I think in this case if you really believe there hasn't been a golden age ... maybe you should provide proof Alex. At the end of the day this is very very subjective, so there isn't a right or wrong answer.

I rest my case!!!!!

You can find more about democracy here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy

I corrected you once before in this point but they are related, this is about freedom of speech and tolerance (which to me you lack badly) of others. Democracy and freedom of speech are things that neither you nor wikipedia can teach me, i already know and i always respect others different point of views and their rights to express them, do you Alex??? (remember actions speak louder than words)

If you want other people respect you - you have to respect them and their opinion which may differ with your opinion and view. You treat checkers at miserable level as Tic-Tac-Toc and I can't accept
this.

I have always respected other peoples opinions. Disagreeing is not disrespect. And i never tried to convert anybody to my way of thinking and i think truth isnt absolute.

I find your accusation of me treating checkers as tic-tac-toe laughable to say the least since you posted in the forum that you think checkers is a kids game.... a pot calling the kettle black???

I run this pool for 15 days. Everyone can select up to 3 answers on this question and has right to re-vote (change opinion) during 15 days.
My choice was: 4,6,7 (Sport+Art+Science, Hobby, Kids brain game)

I have the outmost respect for the game and i wish for a far better future, that is why i gave you sincere advice.
Cheers Alex, keep brandishing your brand of democracy around ....

Danny Alvarez

[Danny_Alvarez]

Danny wrote:

In my opinion at the end of the ninteenth century and beginning of the 20th checkers was at its golden age.

Danny, I think you're right about that.

Danny also wrote:

At the end of the day this is very very subjective, so there isn't a right or wrong answer.

Danny, I know you're right about that!


This subject has fascinated me and brought to mind one of my favorite cowboy poems.
For a bit of fun I've reworked and retitled it here. (Forgive me Mr. Black)


"The Golden Age of Checkers"

We psychoanalyze ourselves
And pondered at our fate.
Then realized that we were born
A hundred years too late.

Back then every school age boy could
Read and write (11-15, 23-18) in code,
And all the papers had checker columns
I'm a speakin' about a hundred years ago.

Once, every checkerist worth his salt
Was well known by his last name.
Mention the name of Wylie now
And the looks you get are absolute insane!

A checker player in this day and age
Gets no respect and when this you realize.
The fact that we are barley gettin' by
Really comes as no surprise.

There was a time when the average Joe
Needed to see 20 or 30 checker moves ahead.
But that's all in the past because
We have progs to do that for us now instead!

We might 've made a livin' at our game
If we'd lived a hundred years ago,
But now our champion Moiseyev
Hardly makes a dime you know.

Somehow I think if we had lived
When checkers reigned supreme
We'd all of carved our niche in history,
At least that is what I've dreamed.

We'd of built our reputations with
Each each and every splendid move.
Our daring exploits would have made
Our names everyday household words.

Amongst the checker players of today
I'm really just an average Joe.
But like to think I'd of been a better me,
If I'd lived a hundred years ago.

If only fortune would have smiled
On me and laid my egg back then.
I'd of been a happy man for sure,
Instead of who I am.

But I guess we should be thankful
In spite of what I've said.
If we'd been born in that "Golden Age"
We'd all surely now be dead!


Alex wrote:

Golden Age of Checkers is still ahead.

I hope you're right Alex! I believe it's much easier to face the future with optimism.

Regards..."Pal"

Thanks for sharing that Pal i enjoyed it
i agree totally about optimism helping.... and i also wish for a better future for our beloved game.

cheers
Danny

[tommyc]

Dream on fellows.............................THE GOLDEN AGE OF CHECKERS/DRAUGHTS is long gone and nevr shall it be returning. If by fate of birth or whatever the cause, no player in this present generation of players will see any GOLDEN AGE .............ever!!

[Danny_Alvarez]

AWWW come on now Tommy don't hex all of us.... you never know they might freeze some of us and we could last till Buck Rogers comes along.... who knows???

By the way if i purchase a lifetime membership to the Tommy fan club, does the membership continue after they defrost me ??? or do i need to pay again??

Also can i get a coupon for the 1/2 price deal ..... no favoritism now, u offered Jay a deal.

Ok i'll better come back to topic b4 i am taken to the forum gallows.... i think ANYTHING is POSSIBLE....
where there's a will (and some unity) there is a way etc etc etc

cheers
Danny

[liam stephens]

Remember Henry Fonda's tag line in 12 Angry Men:

"It might just be possible."

[tommyc]

Dear Alex: the only one here acting in an authoritarian way is you. You called for this thread to be closed because in your opinion there is nothing more to be said. I quote from yesterday both you and me... which one sounds more ‘democratic’ to you????

Never ask a fruit cake is it made of fruit.!!!!!

[tommyc]

By the way if i purchase a lifetime membership to the Tommy fan club, does the membership continue after they defrost me ??? or do i need to pay again??.........................Danny


HMMM membership is perpetual to my club Danny with one provision ,i need a reference of yur good character from a good source !!HMMMMM i wonder who should i ask??? JH the newest member OR Alex Moiseyev the current world champ??.................answers on a postcard please.!! to the ;Tommy Fan Club Ireland.

And talking of post cards i got a nice happy birthday one from one of my good friend in the U.S of A this morning ,quite a nice surprise.[Before yu ask..... yes he is in the Tommy Fan Club]..................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Danny_Alvarez]

Happy Birthday mate, i hope you have an enjoyable day

cheers
Danny