Rating Report of WCDF commitee available!

[tommyc]

Dont get carried away on a cloud just yet. Consider this was an extremely understrength UK/IRE team, the like hadnt been seen before.

To be fair they were under strenght ,ill prepared ,outplayed and outclassed in most departments and the lack of good management was obvious.

This team was not up-to-speed and never played like a unit,and after the first days play were completely demorilised.

So dont blow that horn too loud just yet!!.Be realistic,the British Open was won by Turkmenistan and the World Qt by Barbadoes.

If we win the Ryder Cup Golf this w/end that will be our consolation!/The Tiger is turning into a PUSSYCAT.!!

[mday]

Who are the top possible players to represent both teams in a USA vs World match?

[Michael Holmes]

In other contests that I have seen, USA does not play against all other countries at the same time but rather each country at a time. So, I am not sure if you are asking who the top 12 players in the World are other than USA players who would play against the USA or if you are asking who the top 12 players are from each country. Both would be difficult to answer and I would suggest that each country use their own system to determine this and then their representative could post it. However, if you are asking who the top 12 players are other than USA players that would play against the USA then one method would be to use the WCDF Rating and another would be to ask Ron King who he would want on his team. USA vs the World at one time (top 12 players in the World other than the USA) would be a tough contest for the USA for sure.

To get the top 12 players in the USA you could use the ACF ratings or ask Moiseyev who he would want on his team. Either way, it would most likely not have me on it.
Michael

[Ingo_Zachos]

Here is a short answer to your concers about the rating list:

-All "cross-comparisions" of US vs. Europe or Asian or Barbados players r included in our list (just look at the tourment list).

-The Irish & British team were lower rated then their US opponets, and the result reflected that!
Would you plz notice that fact!
In contrast to what you believe, it does not claim that the US team scored against all odds.

-Also, the Durdyevs played at Prague 2005, Stonehaven 2005 and the Irish Open 2003, where they faced US opponents.
-Alex' elimimator match against Bill Docherty as well as his attandance of the 2002 British Open r also included in the calculations.

You cannot honestly claim that these events were no serious events.
So our list indeed reflects the current situation properly.

We casted aside our personal preference and let an unbiased computer program evaluate the results by a system that is wide-spead and known to be precise and reliable, though it is, not perfect.

Note:

1. The rating differences to your opponent indicates a certain score expectation that you have against any given opponent.
This expectations summarized over all opponets you played results in an expected number of points that you should score, if you want to keep your rating.
If you score better then expected, your rating rises, if you score less, it declines.
So: the system already takes into account that your oppomnents r weaker in a local event, and you r just expected to score a higher percentage, is that unfair or unreasonable ?

If your rating declines, it is because of your failure to score, not because of your paticipation in "minor" events, as the Elo sytem does not boost players playing only in "major" events.
That is a fact!

I don't know if Alex would indeed be ahead if he only played the WC matches. Even if so, it would be only by a small margin, I guess as Ron King scored heavily at the 2005 US Nationals and the Qualifiers 2004 and the Irish Open 2003-2005, as well as in all "minor" US events that he played which he all won ahead of even Alex Moiseyev!

One cannot ignore these facts!

Also, Gene Lindsay and Michael Holmes did not score heavily in all events they played.
They had "mediocre" results in the recent past as the US Nationals 2005 (Holmes) and the US Nationals 2006 (Lindsay), so their low rating is based upon bad results. It is that simple!

It is no mystery that they r rated lower then without these results.
But:
Should we not calculate everybody's bad results?
The system gives an average rating, with he most recent event weighted higher.

It does not:

1. include future results, as we r no prophets.
2. include only maximum strenghts, as we rated all events, including bad ones.
3. include only minimum strenghts, as we rated all events, including good ones.
4. include the quality of the games you played.
It is about the results, not the talent or skills of a player.
So if your rating is bad, it is not a lack of skill of charakter, just a reflection of the results.
5. include a "fun" factor, as we all play with different levels of ambition and fun in our games. Some take it more serious, other less serious.

A rating should not be understood as a leading factor in your life, as the fun I have, the friends I meet and the creativity and "heartblood" as they say here in Germany that I put in my games r the most telling rewards of playing checkers (and chess, and any other board game) to me, and I believe to most players I met or that I contacted on the internet.

Greatinx from hot and sunny Europe,

Ingo Zachos

[Alex_Moiseyev]

To get the top 12 players in the USA you could use the ACF ratings or ask Moiseyev who he would want on his team. Either way, it would most likely not have me on it.Michael

Michael, you can play for "World team" In my case - I'll be glad to watch this match, rather then play. USA team can beat any World team in any type of checkers easiely with or without my help.

From World 12 top players 10 or 11 will be from USA anyway. Without USA it will be a different World - either in checkers or real life.

Alex

[Michael Holmes]

Alex, why would I want to be on the world team when I am a USA Citizen? Remember, we are talking about USA vs World but I am aware that my rating is too low to be considered for the USA team.

Which brings me to Ingo's posting. You mentioned that 'Also, Gene Lindsay and Michael Holmes did not score heavily in all events they played.
They had "mediocre" results in the recent past as the US Nationals 2005 (Holmes) and the US Nationals 2006 (Lindsay), so their low rating is based upon bad results. It is that simple! '

However, you are not using the tournaments where I came in second to Alex in 2006 or 2005, or the tournaments I won in 2004, etc. So, the simplicity of the situation is that not all events are being used to determine the rating. Oh, you could provide a list of what has been used if you want the ones that have not been used.

Michael

[liam stephens]

MATCH SUMMARY EUROPE 15 - 8 USA (LATEST SCORE)

Europe win the Ryder Cup after Swedish rookie Henrik Stenson knocks in the wining putt to beat Vaughn Taylor and bring the team's total up to 15 points.

Perhaps, the way of the future for Checkers.

[tommyc]

G/Morning from victorious IRE/UK.

Maybe we can get Ian Woosnam to manage our nxt team too.

Hello to sunny Germany and im still awaiting your reply Ingo /??/

I thibk Michael is "on "something when a few posts ago he deliriously said there was only two better players than he and Gene now he states he wouldnt make even board 12 on any present USA Team??...Strange.

Ingo is doing one of the "dirty" thankless jobs trying to produce a first rating.im sure it will take time to evaluate it al more precisely.

My thoughts on the Grand master subject is quite simple and i make a proposal that each National Associatation or Federation from each country should produce its own National Grandmaster tables and this be put forward to the WCDF to determine World GM Titles status in association with match results.

The Tiger in surely now a PUSSYCAT?

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Michael, you are on my team !

Tommy, the only problem USA team really has - we have a plenty number of outstanding players like Michael, close in sterngth, and it is really hard to make a choice. Thats it.

Alex

[tommyc]

The answer then is a simple deduction process Aex..........you" close in strength players" just simply play off for places. With management retaining the right to two wild cards as an insurance for out of form players.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

play off for places

Agree.

I was always in favor of this idea. But it is not easy to arrange place, time, find a money and bring in 4-6 people. But an idea of "American Qualify Tournament" is wonderful, has a lot of positive things and must be considered in future.

Alex

[mday]

"The Tiger in surely now a PUSSYCAT?"

Your wording makes zero sense, try again.

Alex, Give your opinion on who would represent both teams in a USA vs World team match. 10 starters + 2 alternates = 12 for each team

[Michael Holmes]

tommyc, my point was that I have been on the team but according to the rankings I should have not. Alex even points out that I am good enough to be on his team and he also points out that there are many USA players that are very close in strength.

It does seem like other countries only have a couple of players here and there that are master players.

Michael

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Alex, Give your opinion on who would represent both teams in a USA vs World team match. 10 starters + 2 alternates = 12 for each team

This is restrictly reponsibilities of the World and USA team captains if such match will be on agenda. It is also very sensitive and controversial subject, and I don't have any intention to be involve

Futhermore, USA player #13 maybe qualify to be on the World team.

Respectfully,

Alex Moiseyev

[mday]

If you were Captain for team USA in such a match, Alex, who would you choose to represent your team then ?

If I was Captain for World team,( but did not play of course) I would choose:

(not in any order of skill)

1) R. King
2) J. Francis
3) W. Docherty
4) H. Devlin
5) R. Pask
6) M. Durdyev
7) B. Durdyev
T. Watson
9) E. Edwards
10) S. Cronin
Alt) J. Walcott
Alt) D. Lorde