Cheating With Secret Signs

[Ingo_Zachos]

Hallo,

ever wondered how it looks like when someone is trying to give secret signs to a player during a game ?

Look like former Chess World Champion Topalov gets the right message from his coach GM Danailov! :

http://www.chessville.com/Editorials/Da ... usted.htm#



P.S: Deep Fritz is like Chinook or Cake Manchester, a very strong program, maybe stronger then a world champion, and Leko is a very strong Grandmaster reknown for his ability to equalize every opening by trading, but concequently he most of the time ends up in dead-drawn endings.

Hope u enjoy it


Ingo Zachos

[kiwinurse]

Enjoyed Ingo, of course we dont have cheats in draughts, it only happens in chess lol

[Alex_Moiseyev]

we dont have cheats in draughts

We had illegal agreement in Prague and Stoneheaven.

[Ingo_Zachos]

...

We had illegal agreement in Prague and Stoneheaven.

Pardon, Alex, but which agreement in Prague r u referring to ?

I saw nobody holding a secret sign

Greetinx from sunny Dortmund,

Ingo Zachos

[Patrick Parker]

scratch ur nose.......white bishop.......
pick ur nose.........black bishop......
jump up and down......checkmate.....
pay more attention to the position than your cheating
partner.....poor chess people

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Pardon, Alex, but which agreement in Prague r u referring to ?

You have my Pardon, Ingo. I am referring to illegal agreement among players. It has nothing to do with signs.

Dear, Ingo, I am playing checkers more than 40 years and there is no reason to create a circus and comedy on this very unforunate subject. It is very serious.

Sincerely,

Alex Moiseyev

[jimloy]

There have been several cheating scandals in bridge, and players have been banned for life. Perhaps such a penalty would discourage cheating in chess and checkers?

[kiwinurse]

Not sure what you are referring to in Prague Alex.When you make statements like that you need to be more specific.

[tommyc]

Your quite right Jan.........Alex.........Get in the corner ,yur way off pitch re. Prague but if yu mean that "a nods as good as a wink to a blind horse" sure that happens all the time in every TY.

Agreed draws happen all the time due to, as Holmes called it in Prague!! and i QUOTE "Mismanagement of Time" thats when a player is down on the clock and a draw i agreed .sure it wouldnt be draughts to have such a fantastic out-clause to get a result/

[Alex_Moiseyev]

Jan / Tommy,

I said everything I wanted and do not have intention to go any further on this matter. We can leave it to history on forum as another monument to "Controversial Alex" !

[tommyc]

Agghhhhhhhh.........So we re getting the pyschological Alex...mmm?/Interesting!

[jimloy]

When my opponent chooses a boring opening variation (like Martins' Rest), he/she is probably signalling a desire for a draw, and I may go along with the draw rather than try to win such an insipid variation. That can't be cheating.

It's probably not cheating to go easy on my friends (perhaps agreeing to a draw in a won position because I need only a draw) and be tough on other players (maybe by using a cook, or playing out a simple draw in hopes of putting my opponent to sleep) when I need only a draw. Happens all the time, and often helps one player at the expense of another player.

Throwing a game or match is usually cheating. But an American bridge team threw a match in a World Championship Ty., in order to get an easy opponent in the next round, and ended up winning the World Championship. Some people considered that cheating. I can imagine that happening in checkers, where I can maybe lose to avoid playing Alex and finish higher than I would have otherwise.

In a chess tournament, a friend of mine lost his first two rounds, then got a bye, and then won his last three rounds, to tie for second place (4th place on tie break), and win a lot of prize money. He didn't lose intentionally, in fact he was depressed because of his early losses. But, I assume people sometimes try this trick of losing early in hopes of an easy tournament.

Throwing a match to help my friend take a higher place is cheating, and we were both cheating if we made a deal to do this, beforehand.

[kiwinurse]

To hint at hanky panky going on at Prague and Stonehaven puts the qualifiers in a very bad light,and people like myself who fly a long way to take part will be disheartened by your comments alex,why bother to come,and pay for flights over, if people can get away with cheating in a very serious match like the qualifier?.And if thats the case what are the referrees doing about it?And why have examples not been made.?If you have knowledge of cheating,why have you not taken it to the WCDF,and why has the WCDF not banned the cheaters from playing again?To my knowledge,and i was at Prague,i am not aware of any cheating occurring.

[Pedro Saavedra]

Kiwinurse says:

> And if thats the case what are the referrees doing about it?And why
> have examples not been made.?

As a chess tournament director I witnessed a clear-cut example of cheating. A player had a win against his best friend and then proceeded to make terrible moves giving back won material (with theatrical slaps of the head) and agreeing to a draw. He could not have just agreed to a draw because there was a crowd watching the game.

Had the player won he would have won undisputed first place and his friend would have tied for third. As it was they tied for first, and though the one player would have won more as undisputed first, the tie gave the pair of them combined a larger pot. But the motivation was more likely simply favoring his friend.

I did not have the nerve to double-forfeit the state champions and one of the other best players in the state. I did publish the game (I had a chess column back then) calling attention to the silly moves. But I was a graduate student and was very nervous about the whole thing. I like to think that if a player had complained I would have at least withheld the price money and sent the game to a committee for a decision. But I was director and organizer, and did not want to stick my neck out.

I tell the story (it happened over 35 years ago) to indicate that life is not easy for a referee confronting a form of cheating which is ambiguous. I have often observed in a chess tournament a player watching a friend's game and smiling or frowning at the position. This could convey a message, but how do you stop it? I have seen somebody in a time struggle with seconds left hitting the clock so it falls on the ground on his opponent's time. And I have seen unwitting illegal actions which I did not have the heart to punish (in a scholastic tournament). A player asked his team captain for permission to accept a draw ( a legal request) and the captain replied, "No. You have a win." The second sentence was illegal, but I am convinced that it was done naively. Since the other captain did not complain, I let it pass with a warning.

So have some understanding for tournament directors and referees. I have been there and know their anguish at making certain decisions.

[Alex_Moiseyev]

To hint at hanky panky going on at Prague and Stonehaven puts the qualifiers in a very bad light,and people like myself who fly a long way to take part will be disheartened by your comments alex,why bother to come,and pay for flights over, if people can get away with cheating in a very serious match like the qualifier?.And if thats the case what are the referrees doing about it?And why have examples not been made.?If you have knowledge of cheating,why have you not taken it to the WCDF,and why has the WCDF not banned the cheaters from playing again?To my knowledge,and i was at Prague,i am not aware of any cheating occurring.

Jan, I don't know right answers on your questions. Maybe there is no reason come and play, I agree with you. Or maybe you can just still get enough points to go through this.

I already proposed WCDF motion about pairing in earlier rounds (1-2) among players from the same country, but noone paid attention to my arguments.

In Russia and FMJD Federations try to resolve this problem for decades with very little success.

I am very disappointed that this happened with draughts. I was hoping we might be an exception, but it was unrealistical dream.

We didn't have this problem before WCDF was created, because only real personal performance was considered and in order to meet a World Champion you have to win very respectable event - USA National or British Open.

This tradition was destroyed. Maybe discontinuing WCDF may resolve the problem ... I don't know.

It is my responsibility as a World Champion to be 100% aware of anything happened around, and be 100% "informational armed". When both stories happened in Prague and Stoneheaven, I knew this after several hours.

Sincerely,

Alex Moiseyev